The Fabulous Learning Nerds

Welcome back to another fantastic episode of your Fabulous Learning. Nerds. I'm Scott Schuette, your host, and with me a man who needs no introduction. Dan the man. Oh yeah, Dan. Boom. You weren't kidding. I mean, isn't that technically an introduction? Um, yeah, maybe. Sure. Yeah, not a problem.

So, How you doing? Oh, you know, fair to mid. That's it. That's it. Right there. Right there, man. That's awesome. That's great. Hey, so, um, I gotta tell a quick story 'cause I'm, uh, I'm in full summer ween mode. Have we talked about full what Summer Ween is and all that other good stuff? No, but I am, I'm super excited to hear.

Oh yeah, yeah. Well, you know, We are less than 90 days away from Halloween.

Love it. And um, you know how Christmas kind of starts, like the week before Thanksgiving? Really? People start, actually Christmas now starts, I think like at the first week of November. People are like, I'm done. Halloween's over, put my Christmas tree up. Right. Or their holiday stuff goes up. And so what has happened with my favorite holiday is that it has creeped into the month of July.

Like if you are shopping right now, um, you will find to, to, to my. Favorite uh, thing. There was just a ton of Halloween stuff out and yesterday we, I had the best intentions. Um, we went to, um, bath and Body Works to check out their new fall candles. 'cause I want my house to smell like Halloween in August.

Right, right. That I like that. Yeah. I dropped about $350 on a whole bunch of stuff. So, but we are spooked up, which is awesome. So That's great. I love it. I love it. I had a friend, um, who, him and his family, they weren't allowed to to celebrate Halloween, which I think is a tragedy in and of itself, but his parents wanted to give him that experience.

So they came up with a holiday that was a play on their name, which kind of rolled right into Halloween. And uh, they instead went to the grocery store and bought all of the frozen fried foods that could fit in a shopping cart and then brought it home and just, and just gorged out on like, Frozen fried foods.

So what'd they, what did they call this holiday? Donovan, which, uh, is a tradition now that my family observes Donovan in addition to Halloween. We do both. Okay. Alright. Donovan And Halloween. I was gonna say that was like cardiac arrest being, which is also great. It's, but it's awesome. You know, we, we could talk about Halloween for the next like, Hour or two, but we're not easy because we got cool stuff to talk about and we gotta so much cool stuff.

Get, um, our other co-host here, uh, you love her Zeta's here tonight, everybody.

Zeta, do you celebrate Donna Ween as well? Oh yeah. That I do. Um, I love, love, love Halloween though. It's like I am so stoked. I'm so ready for it to start getting colder. So happy. We're all stoked for it to get a little bit colder. I'm just gonna say that right now. It's been a little hot. Little hot this summer, just a scooch, so that's great.

Yeah. Yeah. Bring on a little bit of cold and, and water, please. A little bit of rain. That'd, that'd be fantastic. So that's cool. I'm, I'm glad. Uh, what's your favorite holiday? Zayna Halloween. Serious. Yes. Serious. It is. I love it. I love it so much. Uh, it was one of the disappointing things when I grew up.

Spooky. Oh, don't get me going on that. No. So, yep. Okay, great. Well that's, that's fantastic. You're enjoying a great summer meeting. Just don't go to Bath and Body Works unless you have at least $300, which is fine. Hey, uh, folks, we've got. I know, right? We've got a great guest with us, a dear friend of mine, a great professional in our space, and, um, we're gonna get to know all about him in a little segment that we call, what's your deal?

Hey man, what's your deal, Dean Scott, how are you, my friend? I'm doing great. Hey, what's your deal, my friend? You know, first getting a chance to actually talk to fellow learning nerds is absolutely an honor. Um, when I found out you guys did this podcast, I, I knew there were other people out there that, uh, referred to them selves as learning nerds.

So, absolute pleasure to, to. Spend some time with all three of you here. So for me, really just background on me is I've been in the learning space, corporate learning space, to be more specific for right around two decades, which ages me quite a bit, but it's the the truth. And as I've reflected more on it, I kind of got bit by the bug, even dating back to high school and so forth.

But I've worked in multiple different categories of industries. Whether it's, uh, dish network, call center, outsourcing, uh, finance space, you name it, um, it's been a heck of a journey, but most of my learning focus has been in the facilitation space, which once I get got bit by that bug, I knew for sure that is exactly what I wanted to do for my entire profession.

So that is that. That's my jam. It's an awesome jam and it's, it's awesome because, you know, regardless of where you're at and we've, we've got a pretty, you know, wide audience and structural design, some K through 12, all sorts of good stuff. Hey, you gotta know how to speak in front of people and, um, you gotta know how to.

Help your audience connect. So this is awesome. It's been long overdue. Like we should probably talk about this week one, but we didn't. So without that, without further ado, let's go ahead and dive into our topic of the week, shall we?

Alright. This week we've got, um, facilitation presentation. It's an art dean. Tell us about that. What do you mean by that? It's an art for real. Are you for real, sir? You know, this is an epiphany that I came across. Uh, Gosh, couple years ago. And when you think about the, the skillset of presenting or facilitating it is truly an art form at its finest.

And it is so funny. You get a lot of people, and I've been doing this long enough work with multiple teams and it's a great recruiting tool for your team. 'cause if somebody does it right, people are just like, oh my gosh, I want to do that for a living. And then they realize they start to peek behind the curtain, realize.

Uh, this is a lot more work than I anticipated. Yeah, and the art form side of things is really the, the mastery of the skillset to move masses of people in a particular direction through not only your, your body language, but your, your voice, your words, all of that. It's, it's absolutely so cool to actually see, and those that do it, Amazing are the ones that make it look effortless.

And that's where I think that art form really comes into play. You know, one of the things that, um, I've found is that even those people who've been doing this a long time, um, could do some help. I. Right. Um, especially those, like my experience when I got started is it was the sage on the stage. That's what I call it.

Right? So like, I'm getting up, it's, and it's all about me. Right? And, but, but talk to us. It's really not all about me. Who's it about Dean? You know it. And I think that's the, the beauty of it is, It's when, when folks first start out facilitating or or presenting, they do fall into that stage on the stage and, and eventually they start to have that realization that it's not about me, it's about the actual audience themselves.

And that's where, when you think about the audience and how you position things, every single class is going to be different. Every single session is going to be different and unique. The audience is different, and that's where that, that art form really comes into to, to play is how do you adapt to each one of those environments?

And, and, and I think that's the cool part about it, is it's never the same job. It may be the same content, but it's never the exact same class every single time if it's done correctly. Because you're adapting how you may either facilitate the session or deliver your content. Based off of the learners that are in that respective audience.

So I think that begs to ask the question, how does one learn how to adapt? Do you have like a methodology or like maybe some hints or tricks that some people could use? Yeah. Zeta. I love that, that question and it's, it's so amazing to, to think through, um, you know, that adaptation, but. When you start to actually build a skillset, I think the first step is truly starting with yourself as an individual.

Make sure that you are fully prepared, uh, initially, because if you're trying to think, oh, I gotta do all this stuff, you're not gonna spend the time, uh, focusing on the learners. And so I, I've adapted this, what I call a preparation sequence, and I use the exact same process every single time because that's what puts me in a position to succeed.

And because I've built it over time, it becomes kind of a, a, a rhythm. Now to your point, Zeta, that's where I think when, when they start to focus on the learners, there's so many different things that they can do. You can, in preparation, we'll say if it's a, a corporate training class, maybe it's a new hire class, for instance.

You can look at rosters, you can look at backgrounds of those individuals. Are they fresh out of college? Are they career changers? Are they folks that, um, Oh gosh. I'm trying to think now of, of a specific example, but if you look at the, the scope of all those learners, then you start to think through how do you know, how do I need to adapt my style?

Because if they are fresh outta college, they may want to, you know, do certain things or they may want to jump into the systems and start operating. Where if you've got a class full of baby boomers, for instance, you may need to spend a little bit more time diving into the. The step-by-step procedure of, uh, getting into the tool and using technology if, if there is technology and so forth.

So I think getting ahead of it, looking at the, the rosters is, is certainly important. Definitely learn your, learn your audience correct. Like, know who they are. Know, know who you're helping. That's awesome. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And there, there's a bit of a, a cheat code, if you will, that when you actually start the class, if you ask the right types of questions and engage the audience, even as they're coming in, greeting them, saying, hi.

Hey, how's it going? Where are you from? You know, what, what are your interests? I mean, it sounds that nerdy, but you can learn so much about those individuals. Before everything even starts. Then as you get into to class, you can continue with a series of questions that might be more softball related questions, and then you start to get a sense of how they learn based off of one, how they respond, if they respond, and, and some of the types of things that you hear back from them.

So those are some of the things that I've, I've used to really get my, my hands around adapting to the various learners. Thanks, Dean. That's awesome. Yeah. I, uh, you know, I, I got my start in l and d as a facilitator and, uh, I got my start, uh, facilitating like, uh, IT classes, so like working with IT groups and stuff, like that's how, like how I learned to facilitate.

And later on when I got more experience and I began to like have to like facilitate with different groups with different focuses like I, that like approach that had worked so well for me to teach. I'll just be honest, like nerdy and very particular, you know, it folks definitely didn't work for any other group and like, I like my first class with a group of, of, of leaders, like a really struggled 'cause, you know, that's, it.

Just, it's totally different audience, totally different question set, totally different way of engaging. So yeah, a hundred percent know your audience. Yeah. And you know, and, and Dan, I love that, that point because professions also play a big part in how you may facilitate, because it, they want to, it's very black and white, very straightforward.

And yet what I've learned, and this is this, you know, people can, for me, an effigy, whatever, but the two hardest types of audiences to, to facilitate to are salespeople and other facilitators, man. That's salespeople. They want it now. They want it quick. Is this gonna help me make money? And facilitators, they've peeked behind the curtain.

They know what you're doing. And so there's a lot more stress of, am I doing the right things and so forth. So the, the stress level increases depending on the, the profession type that you have, but you're a hundred percent spot on that even it folks can be an interesting adjustment because they just want it straightforward, black and white.

Just gimme what I need and let me do my thing. That's right. Like no fluff, gimme the facts. I actually, I had to teach a group of sales training facilitators and Dean, you're right. Like, it's like, what are you gonna teach? And by the way, what I was teaching them was the art of facilitation, right? We, how do you facilitate better?

And they're all sitting in the class going, what are you gonna teach me now? I had a great. Um, a great mentor, hi. His name is Dean and, and, uh, taught me everything I know, and so I pulled that out. So I pulled out vor. We were going over vor, we had an episode about V. Mm-hmm. So I was going over VOR and like, you know, After a while they were like, oh, wow, this is really good.

But, uh, we did, I did have a sniper in the back and, and that was fun. Um, Dean, do you wanna talk about who the snipers are and how you deal with them? And that's kind of off topic. Yeah. Just about to, about to jump in and say, could you define sniper for like what sniper is? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Got scary. We let our screw, our snipers dean.

So the, the snipers I've encountered in, in my past or in any class are the ones that try to intentionally throw questions your way to trip you up as the facilitator almost to expose Oh, they don't know what they're talking about. And if you get very strong personalities and if they think you don't know my world.

You'll, you'll have usually more of those. Um, I, I, I see this in the finance industry quite a bit, where if you don't come from the finance industry, like, oh, you don't know what this is, and yet you don't have to be a subject matter expert all the time on the content, you can still deliver an exceptional experience.

By knowing those nuts and bolts like VOR as an example, Scott, like you'd mentioned, it's all those, those subtle nuances that if you do it right and position it, you can do all of those fancy ninja tricks and there'll be none the wiser that really you don't have or you've never done the job in some cases.

Because you've created that level of experience. But, uh, when it comes to those, those snipers, it is, I try to, you know, do the Jedi mind trick on 'em and flip it around like, oh, that's, I love that question. And I'm curious, how have you handled that in the past? And in some cases, if they're really push pushing you, they'll say, well, that's why I asked you.

And then I'll go super ninja trick and say, you know what, I love that. And fair enough. Let's see if we can get some, uh, let's phone a friend. Let's ask the rest of the class. How have you handled this? But the key, if you do one of those ninja tricks, is if it comes back once they answer it and it comes back to you as the facilitator, add what, what I call the the 2 cents, add your 2 cents.

And what that is, is it just a simple, hey? Yep, that's right. I love it. Well said. Or I love it. Let me add just one really quick item, and it might be, this is where you go to find additional information, but at least you maintain that level of credibility by at least touching it in some form or fashion as it comes back to you.

So that's what I've done. When you get those snipers and, and they're just like, Ooh, pew, pew, p pew, and they try to, you know, show some chinks in the armor, you know, you, you bring that up. And again, I just go back to like teaching it classes. Like there's so many like tests of knowledge. 'cause that's. How that group like brings value.

They have so much knowledge and so as a facilitator, you know, you, they would come in and they would just be like, oh, test, test, test, test. And if you're not like on top of it, and if you're not, like, you don't have to be a sme, but you do have to like know exactly like those redirect things. Like have those phrases, like I had a phrase I had practiced and it's so long ago now.

I don't have it down, but it's just like, hey, you know, like, yeah, I don't, I don't know that particular thing. I'm gonna go get us some answers though. I'll be back tomorrow with answers. I'm glad you brought it up because obviously it's a hole in my knowledge, but you know, what I do know is how to get you guys ready for success for this next job that you guys are getting for this next role.

So I'm gonna help you guys get that, but I'm not gonna forget your question. I'm gonna bring it back and I'll be back tomorrow. I think we called it the parking lot, but I'm like, I'm gonna put it in the parking lot. I'm gonna come back to it. First thing, top of the class tomorrow. Anybody have any other questions they'd like to see in the parking lot?

You know, like take like a couple minutes. And just like, I don't wanna say stamp down that rebellion, but like, you know, like address it. Like if you got caught and you couldn't answer it, like just meet it head on. And, and Dan, I love that that point and especially the point that you made. 'cause this is something that I've seen in coaching trainers and presenters throughout my careers.

If you have that parking lot, it gets forgotten and you made the critical point of making sure say, yep, absolutely. Let, let me grab some answers and I'll follow up. And then actually doing that, because your credibility may take an ever so slight hit, but it jump takes a huge step forward. When you follow up.

So I think that is a critical thing that you called out there. I'm just always amazed at how many facilitators, a, don't use a parking lot, or B, have no idea what it is because it's so effective. Like, and I love that you brought this up. I don't have to be a subject matter expert. To do my job in facilitation.

As a matter of fact, I've, I, I've trained really boring stuff like fire alarm installation that I do nothing about, nothing. Now, I know way more about fire alarm installation than anybody should possibly know. Um, and, uh, but in the beginning it was like, I don't know this stuff, but I don't need to know this stuff because I have really smart people that I can call.

And I know how to use a parking lot, right? So just some piece of paper on the wall, you know, and hey, we're gonna write this down, and when I come back after break, I'll get you the answers. Um, and they'll know that I'm not the smartest guy in the room, but they'll also know that why I am really there, which is to help them learn.

So, and Scott, I, I think that. That point that you made is, is awesome because it goes to the level of authenticity that is so powerful when it comes to having an exceptional facilitator. 'cause when you and I were working together many, many moons ago, the the cool thing is, is when folks are first starting to learn that they feel like they have to be something that they're not, and they have to kind of find their own voice and that level of authenticity to lean into and say, you know what, Hey, I'm not sure.

Let's go ahead and put this into a parking lot that takes insane amounts of confidence that when you're first starting out is a really hard hurdle to get over. And one other point when you mentioned the, the parking lot where they forget about it. I think the other thing that gets tough is when you think through.

Everything that's associated with facilitating an exceptional session and everything that's on top of your mind, you have this internal checklist that's constantly going. And if you don't have the right level of preparation, you're gonna forget something. And because there's so many things you're trying to keep track of in this, you know, internal checklist of I gotta make sure to have a quality open, I gotta make sure to engage them and give 'em the, the w 'em, I gotta make sure to ask the right types of questions.

I gotta make sure I'm not lecturing the entire time. And that's just, Tip of the iceberg for sure. So I, you made two really good points there, I think. Could you do me a favor? Um, could you define with them, for our audience that doesn't know what it stands for, Another great one where you'd start to throw out acronyms and people like what?

Yeah, so Wfam is the W I I F M, the what's in it for me, and that's the, the most critical element of starting off a session is making sure that you connect whatever it is that you were training or or covering in a presentation, and you connect it to the audience of how it's going to make them better, what it's going to do for them, or whatever the situation may be.

That's great. Thanks for doing that by the way. We're all just excited. We're just a bunch of nerds here talking about something we all deeply care about and so all of a sudden I had this like, mind check of, oh wait a minute. So that was really great. You know, one of the things I wanna transition to, you know, you talked about this being an art form.

Um, we've talked about some great tools, like in, from your perspective, what are some of those keys that really separate. You know, those presenters, um, and those really amazing facilitators, what are, what are some of the things in the art form itself that you think are just really important for us to talk about and for other people to get good at?

You know, Scott, I I love that question and, and it's a big question, um, because if you facilitate it for any ma matter of time and you think of that question, you're just like, holy smokes. There's so much that goes into it. So I, I love that question, and I, for me personally, I boil it down into to four key categories, authenticity.

Confidence preparation and audience experience. And we've touched on some of those already, which is wonderful. And under the authenticity, it's being able to, how do you position yourself in your own voice and you're comfortable, um, being in front of a group of people. And one of the things somebody asked, and it was actually a salesperson asked me this question, like, what are like 2, 2, 2, 3 things that that would make me a great facilitator?

And I looked at 'em, I'm like, no, that's impossible to answer. Yet when I sat back and thought about it, that in order to build a high level of, you know, comfort in your own skin and that authenticity, but also know that you've overcome that confidence barrier where you are comfortable no matter what in front of a class is, if you get to a space where you can be in front of an audience, hands down by your side, just hanging, not not in your pockets, just by your side, not awkwardly, but just hanging there and you're able to be in front of the class, all eyes on you, and you can be.

Silent even for a short period of time, that then demonstrates that you've got an increased level of confidence that you can conquer anything. Because a lot of times when folks are first starting out, their confidence waivers and you see them, if any type of silence occurs, they fill it with their own words.

Versus sometimes you gotta let that silence breathe to let the, the subject matter wash over the, the audience. And sometimes that can help, you know, transition things from short-term to long-term memory, whatever the case may be. But that's that high level of, of confidence, the preparation side of things that I.

I, I think what's key there is every single person, if they're gonna facilitate, should find what do they need to do in order to make sure that they are fully prepared. And it's not just about the material, it's also about themselves. And I get super nerdy when it comes to this, where the, uh, there's more things than I probably should care to admit about what I do personally to make my, make sure that I am.

Prepared to deliver a session because if I'm in the right space, physically, mentally, emotionally, whatever the, the situation may be, then I know I'm walking in much more confident as well when I'm, I'm going into a, a, a session. And then the last component is, is really that audience experience, and it's a lot of the things that we've touched on of.

Making sure that we're focused on the experience. Uh, we have a great opening, we've got great, uh, closings to make sure that we put a bow on the entire cycle. Um, and there's so many different, you know, processes that are out there, but you focus on those four key areas that can really put you in a position to, to succeed as a facilitator or a presenter.

So I have got a question, if you don't mind. Um, so that confidence, right? How, how does. Say someone who doesn't have confidence, they're struck by fear trying to, they know all the material, they know their audience, they get on stage and it's not there. Like what, what kind of advice could you give to them to kinda like help them along?

My hesitation on that question, Zeta is, is tough because it will be very specific to each individual. Um, but in many cases, to your point, that a lot of that fear comes into play of being judged or being exposed, that I'm not an expert. And it's, it's a mental game in many cases. And so what I would task in, and I'll use this very broadly for, for many folks and so forth, um, 'cause I think every person's.

Uh, very specific. Is, I think first and foremost being present is, is gonna be crucial. And, and Scott, you may be, remember this from our dish days. Um, an analogy that went around a ton during that time was the red wagon where everybody has their own red wagons that they carry with them, their personal one, their work one.

When you walk into that, that classroom, Everything that's going on personally park that red wagon outside of the room because when you walk into that class, there is nothing you can do about anything that's happening in your personal life, whether the, um, hot water heater's leaking, or, uh, you're having a fight with your significant other, whatever it is.

Leave that outside and focus on the actual session itself. That can be a, a, a freeing mind, if you will, because you're not worried about other things while you're trying to create that great experience. I think the, you know, the other thing that really comes into play is I. Knowing how to position yourself and what are some of the, the tools to help drive that level of, of presence and credibility.

And one of the things, and, and I have this, this guy, you know, God love him. He's, he's a spectacular facilitator, but we always butted heads around appearance. One of the ways that folks can feel better about their session and feel a little bit more confident is to use the rule that, that I've always stuck to, and I learned this probably 20 years ago, is dress one level above your audience.

Not go, you know, tuxedo, you know, top and tails or anything like that, but just that one level. And it's not because, oh, look at me, I'm better than everybody. No. Full of respect for the audience. They are taking time out of their day to join your session. Don't, don't, uh, don't phone it in, don't, don't, you know, do a half the job.

Demonstrate that level of credibility when you show up. And sometimes if you dress well or you dress a little bit better and you're not just in t-shirts and shorts, you'll feel that much more confident, which can drive that level of, of confidence where you feel more comfortable. Last thing I'll say, Zeta, is preparation.

Whatever your prep. Process is if you go through that full preparation and you know, I've got this down, that's gonna add your confidence going into that session. Does that help, David? That does. That's awesome. Thank you. You know, you talk about like dressing up and like, like ways to like build confidence.

When I was first starting off, um, I didn't have like a lot of like awesome clothes. So like, but like I, you know, I had like your standard like business attire. Slacks, comfy shoes, button up shirt. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And, uh, I, I, one day I had like, I had gotten my shoes muddied and a pair of cowboy boots, and so I put on the cowboy boots to wear all day.

And, uh, first off, they were surprisingly comfortable to stand like eight or nine hours in. So f y it's everybody out there. Cowboy boots are surprisingly comfortable. Number two, uh, like it changed how I walked and it changed how I moved. Like it made people like notice like where I was and like it made my movements seem so much more purposeful and like everybody was like, why are you wearing cowboy boots?

Like it was, it was such a different set, like everybody brought attention to it and pretty quickly I realized that like, oh man, I'm just gonna wear cowboy boots like all the time. So every time I facilitate, I just throw on a pair of cowboy boots. And to be fair, I'm definitely not the kind of person you would picture wearing.

Cowboy boots and you know, I've had many leaders look at me and be like, I get the slacks, I get this, but what's with the cowboy boots? And I'm like, that question right there tells me that they're working, that that's their job. Mm-hmm. So yeah, just like one of those like little weird things for me that's just like helps, helps me like get in the right mind frame mindset.

Yeah. And, and, and Dan, I love the point that you made is, it doesn't have to be huge adjustments, but it can, instead of a polo, maybe it's a button down shirt and, and it's not trying to, you know, say, oh, everybody go break the bank. It's just subtle things like that, just one shirt versus the other. But I love that cowboy boots aspect because, That is one thing that will create loyalty to your brand as a facilitator.

'cause they'll be like, oh, do do you have Dan in your session? Like Dan, which one's Dan? The dude with the cowboy boots. Oh totally. I've got him in my next session. That's awesome. That creates a level of brand loyalty to your sessions, which is something that we should all strive for for sure. So I love that.

And not only that, but you were more comfortable wearing the cowboy boots, correct? Absolutely. Yeah. I'm gonna say for real. Uh, Like eight hours in a pair of like comfy shoes, like it gets old on your feet super fast, but cowboy boots just kind of shift your center balance forward a little bit, just enough so you're on your toes more than your heels.

So definitely, definitely dress the part when you're presenting that. That's, that's excellent advice. You know, all of this brings up a really important point about, you know, Dean, you talked about authenticity, and Dan, you're kind of talking to your, you know, cowboy boots story, which is great, but it's really about finding our own voice.

Dean, could you talk about the importance of finding your own voice and maybe some things that might get in the way? You know, I, I think it, it is really important and, and. Scott, even going back 20 years, we, we saw this together, going through these, these sessions and so forth, that when someone is new to it, I've seen people where they'll be sitting in class, you'll talk to 'em, they'll be engaged, but as soon as they get in front of the, the class I.

They, they almost try to put on their, their old school nineties FM radio DJ voice. Well, thank you for coming to the class. It's great to see everybody. And we're like, what is happening right now? Who's this person in front of us? And it's because they feel like, because they're on the stage, uh, going back to Scott's point, around being a stage on the stage, they have to be something that they're not.

And you know, when it comes to that level of, of authenticity, If, if I could narrow it down to a couple things is whether in the virtual space or even in the live space, the first thing that can help drive a level of authenticity is eye contact. Because if, if there's a bit of nerves that's going on and so forth, you, you have to think, if I'm gonna talk to a person one-on-one, I'm going to look at them.

If you're looking at your notes constantly or people say, oh, just look right above their heads. I've heard that feedback before. I'm like, no, stop it. Get, get out of town with that, because then you're not paying attention to them. You're losing the experience, whatever the case may be. But you can get into that comfort of having a conversation, delivering a, a quality experience, and it can start very easily with, with eye contact.

And don't change your voice. I've also seen folks where they've been given feedback of, oh, you talk too much with your hands, it's, it, you what? Stop it. No, use your hands. If you are a hand talker, do it. Uh, man, I love, love that advice. Mm-hmm. Yes. Sorry. Yeah. And well, and I, and, and, which is great to hear.

'cause I've had some people, you know, butt up against me and they're like, no, no, no. They shouldn't use their hand. Yes, you should use your hands because it creates a different experience. And Vanessa Van Edwards does a whole thing for familiar with her work around the science, behind having your hands visible and if, if they're visible, it builds trust.

And when you are using your hands, it also adds an extra visual element to the presentation. And I've seen it in the virtual space where, uh, people will sit on their hands and it looks so awkward because they feel like they're like a, a caged tiger, like ready to unleash because they're, they're, you know, but they're caged up.

I'm like, use your hands. It adds much more to the presentation and that level of authenticity comes across. Now if it gets too much where they're doing a hand gesture and you're, and it doesn't match what they're talking about, it. Then you can say, uh, let's, let's, let's hold off on that gesture. Um, but if it adds value to it, absolutely do it.

So I think simple things of eye contact, talking to the, the class balancing the eye contact where everybody feels like you're talking with them, and being comfortable in your own skin and using your hands is a beautiful place to start. Wow. Um, this is great. This is fantastic. Uh, Dean. Uh, but sadly we're getting to that point where we have to start to wrap things up.

So what I wanna do is, um, hey, is there something that's really important to you? That you had on your heart that you wanted to share with our audience today that you hadn't had the opportunity to talk about. Um, now's a great time to go ahead and do that. Like what, what are the couple things you want our audience to, to remember when it comes to this idea of presentation and facilitation?

I. Uh, you know, Scott, I appreciate that and you know, as long as I've been doing this and making this my profession of choice, I mean, I'm, I'm a facilitator and, and most people, when they get into learning, they take one or two paths, either designer or facilitator. Rarely do you see somebody that's exceptional at both.

I'm, I'm down that facilitator path and I've, I, I've coached and I've facilitated so many certification classes and I've coached over a thousand trainers and presenters throughout my career, and, and it's, it's painful to watch. I. That fear component side of things. And so I, I, I'm really kind of making this my mission to do everything in my power to rid the earth of that fear of public speaking because there's so much value that comes within, even if you go, just from a society standpoint, if folks can feel comfortable sharing their thoughts, their ideas, and not worried about being nervous, or am I being judged?

Being comfortable in their own skin to convey an idea in a public setting. There's so much power in regards to hearing other ideas, being able to share, or from a presentation and facilitation standpoint, helping others take a journey so they can become better at what they do consistently. So that's, that's become my mission after doing this for so long that I want to help equip anybody and everybody be that much stronger as presenters and facilitators.

I love that I. Oh, it's so great. Ah, too long my friend. Uh, really appreciate it. Hey, could you do me a favor? Could you let our audience know how they could connect with you, Dean? I think the, the best way is on LinkedIn, just, you know, Dean Gris, it's G R I e Ss, S as in Sam. Um, I've. Connect and, and chat quite a bit with folks even through Messenger.

That's probably the best way to connect and as you can tell, I get really excited about talking, facilitation and presenting. So I love talk and shop. That's fantastic. Thanks Dean. And we'll have you back again, uh, sometime soon. I know it 'cause I, there's just such a wealth of knowledge there and I know our audience needs it.

Thanks so much, Daniel son? Yes. Scott, could you do us a favor, could you let our audience know how they could connect with us? Absolutely. Alright. Party people, you know the drill. If you haven't already, send us an email at nerds@thelearningnerds.com. Email us any questions you might have. Join in on the discussion.

Tell us about a time you've had to stand up in front of people and how nervous or not nervous that didn't make you, who'd love to hear more about it. If you're on Facebook, you can find us at Learning nerds for all of our Instagram peeps. Fab Learning nerds. And lastly, for more information about us, what we do and any updates we've got coming up www.thelearningnerds.com.

Scott, thanks, Dan. Hey everybody. Could you do me a favor? Could you go ahead and share this episode with your friends? You're gonna wanna share it? That's right. So I don't care where you got it. Facebook, LinkedIn, wherever you got the show, just hit that share button, make sure that people are listening to it.

We'd really appreciate it. Hit the like button, hit the subscribe button, and hey, leave a review if you like what Dean's talking about. Hey, leave a great review.